| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| bags |
Posted - 08/07/2014 : 10:24:36 PM
I'll put this article in the Cyclone section due to what it could
mean to ECHL future !
http://prohockeytalk.nbcsports.com/2014/08/06/report-echl-and-chl-to-merge/
Report: ECHL and CHL to merge
Dhiren Mahiban
Aug 6, 2014, 10:06 AM EDT
The East Coast Hockey League and Central Hockey League are reportedly in talks to merge.
According to hockey agent Darryl Wolski, the president of the 2112 Hockey Agency, the two professional hockey leagues, which have teams primarily in the U.S., could merge as early as the 2015-16 season.
Wolski added that Bakersfield, Las Vegas, Stockton and Ontario – all teams currently in the ECHL – could join the American Hockey League next year to form a true Western Conference. The AHL has been in discussions with western-based NHL teams about moving their affiliations to the west making it easier for player transactions to occur.
The ECHL currently has 22 teams while the CHL has nine teams schedule to play during the 2014-15 season. The AHL meanwhile has 30 clubs all currently affiliated with an NHL team.
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| 15 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Donnie Hockey |
Posted - 10/07/2014 : 4:00:53 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Cyclonesdiehard
quote:
Originally posted by Donnie Hockey
Done deal!
A little more information would be appreciated.
The official announcement was made today.
http://echl.com/echl-accepts-seven-new-members-p194005 |
| Reggie Dunlop |
Posted - 10/02/2014 : 4:49:36 PM
It's a media circus with all the breaking news about this merger! |
| Cyclonesdiehard |
Posted - 10/01/2014 : 7:52:30 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Donnie Hockey
Done deal!
A little more information would be appreciated. |
| Donnie Hockey |
Posted - 09/30/2014 : 7:37:39 PM
Done deal! |
| Puckhead60 |
Posted - 09/23/2014 : 10:54:12 AM
quote:
Originally posted by bags
Starting to feel like the IHL whose growth turned it into an unstable
league with fragile teams.
With all due respect, that's a bit simplistic evaluation of why the IHL found its eventual demise. There's a ton of different conditions here, the biggest one being that this is a AA league carried financially in a lot of ways by AAA counterparts playing mostly in lower cost facilities with lower operating costs and salaries. The best thing that could happen for the ECHL is to expand to the point where every AAA team has a AA affiliate matched up with it. It may eventually get there, and this is just another step toward that situation. Absorbing the CHL and cherrypicking the strongest franchises would be a great move for the league. Evansville and Ft. Wayne have been solid additions and Indianapolis hopefully will be, too. And there's more out there to be had to help shore things up.
Whether or not the AHL really makes its presence felt in the west is what's interesting to me. If the AHL decides to invest and make that happen, it'd make life in the west for the ECHL that much better, too.
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| bags |
Posted - 09/21/2014 : 9:43:18 PM
Looking at the two leagues, if all teams combine this could be the five conferences:
Pacific:
Stockton
Bakersfield
Ontario
Alaska
Utah
Colorado
Las Vegas (when returns)
Midwest:
Rapid City
Wichita
Tulsa
Allen
Missouri
Northern:
Brampton
Kalamazoo
Fort Wayne
Toledo
Reading
Elmira
Mideast:
Cincinnati
Indianapolis
Evansville
Wheeling
Quad City
Southern:
Gwinnett
South Carolina
Orlando
Florida
Greenville
Starting to feel like the IHL whose growth turned it into an unstable
league with fragile teams. |
| bags |
Posted - 09/18/2014 : 10:11:46 AM
http://www.centralhockeyleague.com/teams/
Here is a map of the current CHL teams
Allen
Brampton
Missouri
Quad City
Rapid City
Tulsa
Wichita
Articles I'm reading show a new CHL schedule for 2014 and the talk is
2015-2016 season for the merge. Merge can set up a good Midwestern conference
and shift us to the mideastern conference |
| Reggie Dunlop |
Posted - 09/17/2014 : 6:27:10 PM
Not so fast!
I found Joe Babik's (ECHL Communications Director) tweet today to be timely and interesting.
Joe Babik #8207;@Joe_Babik 7h
Twitter - where people have been sharing false information since 2006 |
| Cyclonesdiehard |
Posted - 09/17/2014 : 4:23:21 PM
Depends on who you believe on Twitter the ECHL will be allowing the CHL teams to pay a fee to join. Some say it is a done deal as of today, others are saying it will be early next week. Whatever it is minor league hockey has gone to one Double A league. It is going to be an interesting 10 days to see how this all shakes out. |
| Cyclonesdiehard |
Posted - 09/17/2014 : 4:20:58 PM
http://allenamericansblog.blogspot.com/
Wednesday, September 17, 2014
Allen Americans and CHL Update - A Blogger's View
- Not much else being discussed about hockey other than what is about to happen with the CHL & ECHL. Have been getting a lot of questions since tweeting on Monday that something was in the works about what I think will happen. Now that it is a forgone conclusion that the two leagues will become one as soon as today thought it is time to exercise the blogger prerogative to speculate on some of the details. Most readers of this blog realize there is no connection between the blog and the Allen Americans but want to emphasize how tight lipped the front office of the Americans has been around this issue as they will not confirm or deny anything related to the ECHL. However, the avid fans and bloggers around the league are an industrious group who share a lot of information with one another. So put this in the rumor, speculate, guess, conjecture, assumption category with educated in front of each word.
- The deal was supposedly done yesterday and just the final details are being worked out. Kind of like when you close on a new house and you are just waiting on the money to get transferred. You can only imagine all of the details related to an action like this. The business side/off ice issues are the biggies though most are talking about the on ice issues which are of more interest to fans. Best case scenario is an announcement is made today but that is not certain.
- Best guess is all of the current CHL teams go to the ECHL and maybe even one of the teams that suspended operations.
- The CHL teams will be playing in the ECHL for the upcoming season inspite of the short time frames. And short time frames are right around the corner. Everything will be moved up by a week or more. Here are the ECHL critical dates:
October 2 - Players may report to training camp (training camp rosters due 3 pm ET)
October 3 - First day of on ice sessions
October 15 - Opening day rosters due (3 pm ET)
October 17 - ECHL regular season begins
- While many are speculating how the schedule will look the best guess is there will be many more changes than people are anticipating. The new schedule will look much more like a redone schedule than merely inserting the CHL schedule into the ECHL schedule. Might be some new places for the Allen Americans to visit.
- The rules that will be followed will be the ECHL rules so not a lot of interim/transition rules. The ECHL has gone through this process in the past with other leagues and the general rule in the past has been you will follow ECHL rules with no exceptions. It might be different this time but probably not. Remember the CHL allows six vets and define a vet as over 300 professional games while the ECHL is four veterans and 260 games. This will most likely cause some roster changes and some veteran players that are being recruited under the CHL rules will not be signed.
- In all likelihood the rights to CHL players from the team's protected list will be lost. The only way to get these players back (if they have signed in the ECHL) would be through trade or waivers. Would assume those that are in Europe will become free agents but not sure on this. As a reminder, those on the protected list for Allen are:
Spencer Asuchak
Greger Hanson
Trevor Hendrikx
Kale Kerbashian
Garrett Klotz
Alex Lavoie
Bryan Pitton
Ross Rouleau
- Roster size and salary caps are very similar between the leagues especially with the changes the CHL was planning for the upcoming season but there are differences. The ECHL active roster can be 21 for the first 30 days of the season and then drops to 20. This compares to the CHL which this year was going to have an active roster size of 19. These numbers do not include injured reserve players.
- The CHL salary cap was going to be $12,000 per week this year while the ECHL salary cap for 2014-2015 is $12,615 for the first 30 days of the season (because of the one extra roster spot) and then drops to $12,200.
- Not positive on this one but the rookie salary cap (maximum you can pay a rookie) is $550 in the CHL and only $510 in the ECHL so all of the rookies already signed in the CHL will be taking a small salary cut.
- As for season ticket holders the best solution for what will be three additional home games (the CHL has a 66 game schedule while the ECHL plays 72 games) is to allow them to buy those games on a game by game basis at their season ticket price. This may be a team by team decision.
- Many other logistics will have to be accelerated. First and foremost will be notifying the players about the new schedule but think of the reworked travel schedules, new insurance, apartments need to be ready earlier, immigration papers for Canadian residents will have to be filed just to name a few. It can all get done but will take a lot of extra work by front offices, coaches, and fan clubs to make the transition happen smoothly.
- The ECHL has had an agreement with CCM (a subsidiary of Reebok) for many years to provide all on ice equipment (sticks, visors, helmets, gloves and trousers) and last year became the exclusive provider of home and away jerseys for the ECHL. If this agreement continues this is another area of change for the CHL teams.
- The Allen Americans are so fortunate they have Steve Martinson as their coach through this transition as his eighteen years of head coaching experience (which includes eight championships) will be put to the test. Martinson has coached in the CHL and ECHL and was also the head coach of the San Diego Gulls back in 2003 when the West Coast Hockey League (WCHL) was absorbed by the ECHL. The first year in the ECHL Martinson coached the Gulls to a record of 49-13-0-10 which may still be a record for first year teams in the ECHL. Bottom line is there is not a better coach in the country with the experience to deal with what the Americans are about to go through.
- Was talking with a corporate sponsor yesterday and they are excited about a potential move to the ECHL as they feel their sponsorship dollars will become more valuable in a league that is more visible and prestigious. When this deal is announced they feel their sponsorship deal will be worth more money without having to spend an extra dollar.
- Can't help but think about the last five years and all of the effort owner Doug Miller put into getting the team to the ECHL. This blog was a big advocate of that move in the early years. But it is time to think about what was wished for now that it is about to become a realty. The CHL has been very good to the fans in Allen as the team has won two championships the last two years and lost in the finals in their first year in the league. Add two Governor's Cups as regular season champions and it has been quite a ride. It is going to be much more difficult going into a league with close to 30 teams. Some of the CHL fans are going to be longing for the good old days of the CHL when their teams are mired in the bottom part of the ECHL standings in out of the playoffs spots. Expectations may have to be lowered, however, Steve Martinson will not be one of those lowering expectations.
OTHER ITEMS:
- It is now official that Phil Fox has been selected for a job at Northern Michigan University. Talked to him recently and he has been back in Michigan for a couple of weeks. In addition to his job he will also be working on his masters degree. Here is the press release announcing his hiring:
"A former NMU hockey captain is returning to Marquette to work as the program’s hockey operations manager. Phil Fox played for the Wildcats from 2007 to 2011 and served as a captain for three of his four years. He’s 21st all-time in career games played for NMU with 155. Fox was a forward and notched 40 goals and 20 assists in his college career. After graduating from NMU, he played professionally in the Central Hockey League for three seasons and also played one game with the Houston Aeros of the AHL."
- Former Allen Americans player Jim McKenzie has signed with the Bakersfield Condors (ECHL) and will go to camp with Oklahoma City (AHL). Jim split last season with the Quad City Mallards and the Iowa Wild (AHL). Jim joins Jonathan Lessard who has also signed with Bakersfield.
- The Americans have a new equipment manager and trainer on board and the names will be familiar to fans in the area. A news release from the team with all of the details will be issued soon.
- Noticed while doing the "30 Questions Series" the current roster of Allen American's players has some talented individuals. Haven't gone through the entire roster yet but some top notch students are on the team. Aaron Gens graduated with honors, Brian McMillin, Andrew Hamburg, and John Ryder were all on the NCAA (WCHA) all-academic team for multiple years in college, and Raphael Girard is a Harvard grad. And I am sure there are more.
- Heard that Knight Furniture will again be sponsoring a replica Presidents' Cup banner give away as they did last year on banner raising night. Unless the date changes the banner raising is scheduled for October 24th. |
| PsychFan |
Posted - 08/28/2014 : 4:49:10 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Dr. Feelgood
I'm not backpedaling. I believe you're just not grasping this concept. I haven't changed my stand point. I'm basing mine off fact. You're basing your's off assumption and fantasy booking.
I never said a team wouldn't jump at the chance to jump up to the AHL. Nor did I say NHL teams wouldn't like closer affiliates.
I said that it's not up to the affiliate where a team is located. An ownership group determines where a team goes. Some NHL teams own their AHL franchises and most do not. I believe this is what's confusing you in to thinking NHL teams can tell the AHL that a team will go wherever they like.
Hockey is no different than MLB. The Reds can't tell the IL they're moving their team to Dayton. That'd require Louisville or some other exisitng franchise to move unless they were willing to expand membership. Except to make this scenario relatable the IL has no interest in expanding membership (likely the case). So when a team does move (which does happen) the ownership chose to move them to a different city.
If you notice in minor sports leagues ownership groups (ECHL is the PERFECT example of this) will say "We'd like franchises here but we need a solid ownership group or interested ownership group to step forward).
NHL teams do not control where their affiliates are located unless they own them.
Btw you're still throwing in your unsolicited attitude. I'll give you credit for going one post earlier without being snarky.
To assume you're basing your opinions on fact is laughable. Seriously laughing. I'm done trying to explain this to you. Have fun in fantasy land. |
| Dr. Feelgood |
Posted - 08/28/2014 : 4:44:23 PM
I'm not backpedaling. I believe you're just not grasping this concept. I haven't changed my stand point. I'm basing mine off fact. You're basing your's off assumption and fantasy booking.
I never said a team wouldn't jump at the chance to jump up to the AHL. Nor did I say NHL teams wouldn't like closer affiliates.
I said that it's not up to the affiliate where a team is located. An ownership group determines where a team goes. Some NHL teams own their AHL franchises and most do not. I believe this is what's confusing you in to thinking NHL teams can tell the AHL that a team will go wherever they like.
Hockey is no different than MLB. The Reds can't tell the IL they're moving their team to Dayton. That'd require Louisville or some other exisitng franchise to move unless they were willing to expand membership. Except to make this scenario relatable the IL has no interest in expanding membership (likely the case). So when a team does move (which does happen) the ownership chose to move them to a different city.
If you notice in minor sports leagues ownership groups (ECHL is the PERFECT example of this) will say "We'd like franchises here but we need a solid ownership group or interested ownership group to step forward).
NHL teams do not control where their affiliates are located unless they own them.
Btw you're still throwing in your unsolicited attitude. I'll give you credit for going one post earlier without being snarky. |
| PsychFan |
Posted - 08/28/2014 : 3:43:19 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Dr. Feelgood
quote:
Originally posted by PsychFan
quote:
Originally posted by Dr. Feelgood
quote:
Originally posted by PsychFan
quote:
Originally posted by Dr. Feelgood
Problem with this is mostly in the "Western ECHL teams to the AHL". AHL currently has 30 teams owned and won't expand beyond 30 unless the NHL were to expand beyond 30. This would require multiple franchises to be willing to relocate or be sold and relocated. I believe there is 1 or 2 at most currently in the AHL that could possibly do this.
Wrong again. Provided that the Western ECHL teams turned into AHL franchises, the teams out east that get left out in the cold would likely be adopted by the ECHL. For example, should a team like Stockton become the AHL team for San Jose, the Worcester Sharks (their current affiliate) would join the ECHL. There are plenty of NHL teams that would look to do the same team. Put it to you this way, I'd be surprised if we didn't see a vastly different minor league hockey landscape next summer. PS, it's not up to the AHL teams to say whether of not the parent club relocates. Just ask the old Cincinnati Mighty Ducks ownership.
Nice try though.
Btw way to continue to be an unsolicited jerk on these message boards whenever you put your two cents in.
AHL President Dave Andrews has said they're not expanding beyond 30 franchises so that dismisses any notion of ECHL/CHL teams being absorbed into the league.
Not all NHL team's own their AHL/ECHL clubs. They would have the option of buying an existing franchise and moving it out west or trying to find an existing owner and partnering up to move the team to a new location out west.
Not meant to be a jerk. Just stating that you are wrong. And you have missed the point, it would seem. An AHL franchise cannot operate without an NHL parent club attached. So back to my San Jose example: if the Sharks decide to pull out of Worcester, they will no longer be able to operate in the AHL. Whether the Sharks had an ownership interest in Worcester or not is irrelevant.
Don't take my word for it. Here's one of many articles laying out the substantiated rumors.
http://prohockeytalk.nbcsports.com/2014/08/24/report-ahl-migration-west-could-begin-in-2015-16/
Best to fact check before you throw stones.
That's not how league membership works. That would mean the owner of a franchise would need to be paid the value of an AHL franchise and compensation, move his team, or sell his franchise. Doing what you're saying would get the AHL sued.
What you're saying is factless and baseless.
What Donnie Hockey and I have stated is how AHL membership works. If you don't own a club you must find one to work a deal with to set up a parent club situation. They can't make their own franchise because the AHL is at 30 teams and won't expand beyond 30 per their own President. If San Jose wants to move their farm team out west and do not own their AHL affiliate they must find one willing to move or purchase one.
Are several teams likely to move out if the situation arises? Yes. But to assume every healthy western ECHL franchise will be moved to the AHL is unlikely unless a franchise is willing to move out west for each one.
IE: The Columbus Blue Jackets can't simply say "We want a team in the AHL close by so we're making an AHL team in Cincinnati." They'd need to purchase a team and move it or find an owner willing to do so.
Just because a blog writer or report reposts something or writes something doesn't make it a fact. You should trust the AHL President for correct information over a reporter.
"Some people you just can't reach." Do you think the AHL President is going to tip his hand in ANY way unless something is official? No. Hell no. And you are forgetting the key in all of this. I'm not saying that the Jackets can say "Oh let's go to Cincinnati" and just set up shop. What I'm saying is that a team, San Jose, per say, would work with an ECHL ownership group, like Stockton and say - "we're going to make you are new AHL affiliate provided the numbers work out." Then, as I said before, the current AHL affiliate in Worcester would be SOL and would likely be adopted by the ECHL - since, you know, they are a business.
And what makes you think the "healthy" Western teams wouldn't jump at the chance to move up to the AHL?
You seem to be backpedaling. Not surprising. But thanks for stopping by. |
| Dr. Feelgood |
Posted - 08/28/2014 : 1:31:24 PM
quote:
Originally posted by PsychFan
quote:
Originally posted by Dr. Feelgood
quote:
Originally posted by PsychFan
quote:
Originally posted by Dr. Feelgood
Problem with this is mostly in the "Western ECHL teams to the AHL". AHL currently has 30 teams owned and won't expand beyond 30 unless the NHL were to expand beyond 30. This would require multiple franchises to be willing to relocate or be sold and relocated. I believe there is 1 or 2 at most currently in the AHL that could possibly do this.
Wrong again. Provided that the Western ECHL teams turned into AHL franchises, the teams out east that get left out in the cold would likely be adopted by the ECHL. For example, should a team like Stockton become the AHL team for San Jose, the Worcester Sharks (their current affiliate) would join the ECHL. There are plenty of NHL teams that would look to do the same team. Put it to you this way, I'd be surprised if we didn't see a vastly different minor league hockey landscape next summer. PS, it's not up to the AHL teams to say whether of not the parent club relocates. Just ask the old Cincinnati Mighty Ducks ownership.
Nice try though.
Btw way to continue to be an unsolicited jerk on these message boards whenever you put your two cents in.
AHL President Dave Andrews has said they're not expanding beyond 30 franchises so that dismisses any notion of ECHL/CHL teams being absorbed into the league.
Not all NHL team's own their AHL/ECHL clubs. They would have the option of buying an existing franchise and moving it out west or trying to find an existing owner and partnering up to move the team to a new location out west.
Not meant to be a jerk. Just stating that you are wrong. And you have missed the point, it would seem. An AHL franchise cannot operate without an NHL parent club attached. So back to my San Jose example: if the Sharks decide to pull out of Worcester, they will no longer be able to operate in the AHL. Whether the Sharks had an ownership interest in Worcester or not is irrelevant.
Don't take my word for it. Here's one of many articles laying out the substantiated rumors.
http://prohockeytalk.nbcsports.com/2014/08/24/report-ahl-migration-west-could-begin-in-2015-16/
Best to fact check before you throw stones.
That's not how league membership works. That would mean the owner of a franchise would need to be paid the value of an AHL franchise and compensation, move his team, or sell his franchise. Doing what you're saying would get the AHL sued.
What you're saying is factless and baseless.
What Donnie Hockey and I have stated is how AHL membership works. If you don't own a club you must find one to work a deal with to set up a parent club situation. They can't make their own franchise because the AHL is at 30 teams and won't expand beyond 30 per their own President. If San Jose wants to move their farm team out west and do not own their AHL affiliate they must find one willing to move or purchase one.
Are several teams likely to move out if the situation arises? Yes. But to assume every healthy western ECHL franchise will be moved to the AHL is unlikely unless a franchise is willing to move out west for each one.
IE: The Columbus Blue Jackets can't simply say "We want a team in the AHL close by so we're making an AHL team in Cincinnati." They'd need to purchase a team and move it or find an owner willing to do so.
Just because a blog writer or report reposts something or writes something doesn't make it a fact. You should trust the AHL President for correct information over a reporter. |
| Donnie Hockey |
Posted - 08/28/2014 : 12:01:28 PM
quote:
Originally posted by PsychFan
quote:
Originally posted by Dr. Feelgood
quote:
Originally posted by PsychFan
quote:
Originally posted by Dr. Feelgood
Problem with this is mostly in the "Western ECHL teams to the AHL". AHL currently has 30 teams owned and won't expand beyond 30 unless the NHL were to expand beyond 30. This would require multiple franchises to be willing to relocate or be sold and relocated. I believe there is 1 or 2 at most currently in the AHL that could possibly do this.
Wrong again. Provided that the Western ECHL teams turned into AHL franchises, the teams out east that get left out in the cold would likely be adopted by the ECHL. For example, should a team like Stockton become the AHL team for San Jose, the Worcester Sharks (their current affiliate) would join the ECHL. There are plenty of NHL teams that would look to do the same team. Put it to you this way, I'd be surprised if we didn't see a vastly different minor league hockey landscape next summer. PS, it's not up to the AHL teams to say whether of not the parent club relocates. Just ask the old Cincinnati Mighty Ducks ownership.
Nice try though.
Btw way to continue to be an unsolicited jerk on these message boards whenever you put your two cents in.
AHL President Dave Andrews has said they're not expanding beyond 30 franchises so that dismisses any notion of ECHL/CHL teams being absorbed into the league.
Not all NHL team's own their AHL/ECHL clubs. They would have the option of buying an existing franchise and moving it out west or trying to find an existing owner and partnering up to move the team to a new location out west.
Not meant to be a jerk. Just stating that you are wrong. And you have missed the point, it would seem. An AHL franchise cannot operate without an NHL parent club attached. So back to my San Jose example: if the Sharks decide to pull out of Worcester, they will no longer be able to operate in the AHL. Whether the Sharks had an ownership interest in Worcester or not is irrelevant.
Don't take my word for it. Here's one of many articles laying out the substantiated rumors.
http://prohockeytalk.nbcsports.com/2014/08/24/report-ahl-migration-west-could-begin-in-2015-16/
Best to fact check before you throw stones.
If San Jose wanted to pull out of Worcester put their AHL prospects in Stockton, one of the current 30 AHL franchises would have to relocate to Stockton for that to happen. There are only 30 AHL franchises. No new franchises will be awarded unless the NHL expands.
Worcester, Springfield, Portland, Norfolk are among the AHL franchises I can see being purchased and relocated elsewhere in the foreseeable future.
Ultimately, the plan the NHL, AHL and ECHL are working on is for there to be an equal number of NHL, AHL and ECHL teams, similar to how baseball is set up with MLB, Triple-A and Double-A.
Each season the ECHL becomes more important to NHL teams as part of its player development program.
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