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elvis77
(Loves To Post!)
1435 Posts |
 Posted - 11/08/2013 : 9:03:37 PM
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How does it leave a void? These 2 have had nothing to do with the team that is currently 6-0. In the ECHL you can't live in the past and honestly, I don't think either of them could skate with the pace of the rest of the guys on this team. Aubin's issue has always been his skating. He's got a quick first few step which helps him get from the corners to the front of the net but he's got no top end speed and his break outs get shut down from behind with regularity. Pelech's skating leaves a lot to be desired. He's got plenty of puck skills but he lacks the pace to stay with these guys. His decision making was always a step behind too. He had to be removed from the PP last season because he was so slow to move the puck.
Finally. 2 players had to be moved. Who do you release/trade to keep them? Eves? Not a chance. He makes everyone around him better and has stepped up and played every position but goalie. Birkholz? Has hell frozen over? Josh skates circles around them both. Embach? Give me a break. The kid has never quit on a play unlike the defensive blueline turnover machine Pelech. Kyle Bodie? OK perhaps, but the kids a rookie, costs a fraction of Pelech and Aubin, and doesn't have the current off ice baggage. Any of the defensemen? Nope sorry. Defenseman are way to valuable to deal in an early season futures deal and given the beating that dmen take it doesn't take long for for a team to go from "comfortable" with 1 or two dmen in the stands to "scrambling for a capable body" due to injuries and call ups.Factor in the off ice issues and the move makes perfect sense. |
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danc
(The Next Level!)
114 Posts |
Posted - 11/08/2013 : 10:57:21 PM
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So losing 2 point per game guys, one of whom had 2 cups-and is only 27 years old, doesn't lessen the team one bit in your team in any manner. OK.
Tony Turgeon, Bodie, Daniels, Wysopal could have gone instead. Birkholz is a project. I like him, but at this point he's a PK specialist who isn't dressing most of the time. Birkholz didn't even dress for most of the playoffs last year, while Aubin and Pelech were key in several games.
The off ice "baggage" was minimal, if any in reality. They're with Utah and Skalde obviously was consulted, in fact, may have brokered the deal, so the "baggage" is a non isssue.
No point arguing with your obsession with defensemen. This team is averaging 5 goals and is driven by its offense. Megan will be gone soon, MacFarland perhaps as well.
This move was about establishing this club as Simon's team. It was done at the expense of getting rid of some very good and established ECHL talent. We'll see if it works out, but to present it as a move in which the least useful players were sent packing is, well, silly.
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Randy
(The Next Level!)
USA
432 Posts |
Posted - 11/08/2013 : 11:45:37 PM
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| It doesn't matter how much talent you have if you can't represent the team off the ice. |
Cyclones Fan, Win or Lose
Bengals Fan - Never! |
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SCUBA
(Been Here Awhile)
USA
584 Posts |
Posted - 11/09/2013 : 12:49:09 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Randy
quote:
Originally posted by SCUBA
I had a sneaky suspicion it wasn't injury related.....still don't know the story but new coach and suddenly several hard working players on the IR? We'll never know the true story. So who's the new "C"?
They were on IR due to injury
The IR list IS from time to time used to place players not injured. I don't have proof or a story, but there is most certainly a story. I'm reading from post to post about the trade being either a good idea of a bad one. It comes down to one FACT. Professional sports, you kinda have to deal with it and how it plays out. |
Edited by - SCUBA on 11/09/2013 12:56:18 AM |
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PsychFan
(Finally Got A Star!)
98 Posts |
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PsychFan
(Finally Got A Star!)
98 Posts |
Posted - 11/09/2013 : 01:48:54 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by danc
So losing 2 point per game guys, one of whom had 2 cups-and is only 27 years old, doesn't lessen the team one bit in your team in any manner. OK.
Tony Turgeon, Bodie, Daniels, Wysopal could have gone instead. Birkholz is a project. I like him, but at this point he's a PK specialist who isn't dressing most of the time. Birkholz didn't even dress for most of the playoffs last year, while Aubin and Pelech were key in several games.
The off ice "baggage" was minimal, if any in reality. They're with Utah and Skalde obviously was consulted, in fact, may have brokered the deal, so the "baggage" is a non isssue.
No point arguing with your obsession with defensemen. This team is averaging 5 goals and is driven by its offense. Megan will be gone soon, MacFarland perhaps as well.
This move was about establishing this club as Simon's team. It was done at the expense of getting rid of some very good and established ECHL talent. We'll see if it works out, but to present it as a move in which the least useful players were sent packing is, well, silly.
You're becoming the laughing stock of this forum, danc. Let me tell you why you are wrong (again).
- Turgeon is a Florida prospect - he can't go anywhere
- Daniels and Wysopal are defensemen. Neither Aubin or Pelech can play defense. So if you get rid of Daniels and Wysopal, who plays on the blue line? Your logic is baffling.
- I could see maybe moving Bodie, but who would really want to make a deal for him? Nobody, that's who.
- Birkholz has three times the speed as Pelech or Aubin.
- "27" doesn't sound like it's that old, but by ECHL standards - it's VERY old. Consider how many players are 19-20-21 years old. 27 is pretty up there. Get your facts straight.
- Have you considered that the offense we've seen is thanks in part to some stifling defense? Probably not, because you obviously don't know hockey. You must love box scores, too.
Do us all a favor and find a new forum to spew your garbage. |
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danc
(The Next Level!)
114 Posts |
Posted - 11/09/2013 : 03:04:00 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by PsychFan
quote:
Originally posted by danc
So losing 2 point per game guys, one of whom had 2 cups-and is only 27 years old, doesn't lessen the team one bit in your team in any manner. OK.
Tony Turgeon, Bodie, Daniels, Wysopal could have gone instead. Birkholz is a project. I like him, but at this point he's a PK specialist who isn't dressing most of the time. Birkholz didn't even dress for most of the playoffs last year, while Aubin and Pelech were key in several games.
The off ice "baggage" was minimal, if any in reality. They're with Utah and Skalde obviously was consulted, in fact, may have brokered the deal, so the "baggage" is a non isssue.
No point arguing with your obsession with defensemen. This team is averaging 5 goals and is driven by its offense. Megan will be gone soon, MacFarland perhaps as well.
This move was about establishing this club as Simon's team. It was done at the expense of getting rid of some very good and established ECHL talent. We'll see if it works out, but to present it as a move in which the least useful players were sent packing is, well, silly.
You're becoming the laughing stock of this forum, danc. Let me tell you why you are wrong (again).
- Turgeon is a Florida prospect - he can't go anywhere
- Daniels and Wysopal are defensemen. Neither Aubin or Pelech can play defense. So if you get rid of Daniels and Wysopal, who plays on the blue line? Your logic is baffling.
- I could see maybe moving Bodie, but who would really want to make a deal for him? Nobody, that's who.
- Birkholz has three times the speed as Pelech or Aubin.
- "27" doesn't sound like it's that old, but by ECHL standards - it's VERY old. Consider how many players are 19-20-21 years old. 27 is pretty up there. Get your facts straight.
- Have you considered that the offense we've seen is thanks in part to some stifling defense? Probably not, because you obviously don't know hockey. You must love box scores, too.
Do us all a favor and find a new forum to spew your garbage.
Pyche Case,
You're getting a bit too angry. Have your meds adjusted. Soon.
I'll address you errant nonsense point (or should I say pointless) by point(less):
1) Turgeon could be on a San Antonio deal, so I guess I'm wrong on that front, but he's not a "Florida prospect". Show me where he's on an NHL deal. He's not, sport.
2) I threw out four names. I didn't state that two defensemen had to go. The Cyclones currently have 8 defensemen on their roster. They could live with 7 if need be. Eves can play defense in a pinch.
3) One can always just release a player. A "deal" doesn't have to be made. Many "future consideration" deals end up being a $1 exchange between the two clubs. Bet you didn't know that, hotshot.
4) Three times the speed? Fastest player by a factor of two, ever. Once again, I like JB and think that he's an interesting project, but he's awfully raw and needs significant refinement. Speed in and of itself, is not necessarily useful. Birkholz has NHL skating ability-that's for sure.
5) You make no coherent point. 27 is not over-the-hill for an ECHL player. Very rarely are players 19 years old. In fact, could you name the 19 year olds who have played for the Cyclones in the past 8 years? 20 year olds for that matter.
6) Yes, I do like box scores and event and game summaries. One can learn quite a bit from them. You, however, should learn what a "stifling defense" is. Rob Madore-who has played all but one of the Cyclones games- is sporting a 2.91 goals against average. Good for 28th in a 22 team league. The only thing that is stifling is, apparently, the oxygen flow to your brain which may be the cause of your faulty observations.
May I suggest that you observe the games and not look at them through your pitiful preconceptions?
Remember to tend to your meds. |
Edited by - danc on 11/09/2013 03:05:38 AM |
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SCUBA
(Been Here Awhile)
USA
584 Posts |
Posted - 11/09/2013 : 09:58:25 AM
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| Just like Weber leaving several years ago, Dale DeGray, Don Biggs the list goes on, it's sports...gone is gone. Wish Aubin and Pelech luck. The only time we may have to face them is in the Finals which isn't a bad thing. Either argument is pointless, because I doubt that the Clones asked anyone of us who should be traded. The Cyclones are 7-0 currently and seems to be playing well. I'm a little concerned why last nights game ended up so close because I left the podcast with it being 5-2 but nontheless, Live in the present folks. |
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dbc
(Been Here Awhile)
865 Posts |
Posted - 11/09/2013 : 10:07:49 AM
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Gee--the team is 7-0 and you two sound like they are 0-7. Fact is we will never know why the deal was done. Maybe performance on the ice, performance off the ice, attitude, too may affiliated players, or just that the Cyclones had decided for whatever reason that the two did not fit in their plans ( speed?) and they traded them together as they are good friends and wanted to give them a chance to play somewhere together rather than just cutting them and having to absorb all or part of their contracts..
Suggest you both chill a bit and enjoy the team and let this be a space where we can all enjoy it and voice our OPINIONS. Nothing drives posters away faster than having to read two bickering know it alls. Thanks. |
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BP2011
(Been Here Awhile)
USA
531 Posts |
Posted - 11/09/2013 : 10:10:32 AM
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I honestly think that because Aubin has been here for 6 years and Pelech was a returning player people get upset when the returners get traded because they want to be here in a league where a large change over is an every second occurrence. People grow to follow these players as we saw when Skalde did not offer Ehgoetz a contract in 11-12 people were baffled to all out mad.
Obviously this is a business, we dont know what happened in the coaches room when these two were informed they got traded, sure we can probably guess the right answer but unless Simon says something (which we know he won't as coaches never do) its all assumption. Myself I am one of those people that appreciate a players appreciation to a city and want to play for a certain team if they are on East Coast deals. At the same time, its a business and it is also harder when you have two affiliates that give you half the team and you cant live in the two weeks from now, or three months from know thinking that the affiliate players wont be there, you have a roster that is mandated to have a certain number of folks and right now personally I think Eves will become the new Ehgoetz or Aubin, he has been here for 4 seasons and is now the "cagy vet" on the team, but what people have pointed out is he will play forward, but also play D and that is why he could stay longer for any coach when you do anything for the team.
Was I upset that Aubin and Pelech got traded, yes, returners who are big point scorers and Aubin had the connection of winning championships with the team that now is only with coach MacDonald, but to trade another Captain to Utah.......was just asking for some older fans to say here we go again.
However, you move on and you watch the team that is on the ice and know that this is more then a business, its business from a salary front and dual affiliate business. Had the team not done well, the deal probably would not have gone down like this, but right now the current team and ice product is 7-0-0 and knock on wood continues as long as possible. |
08, 10 Kelly Cup Champions
08, 10, 14 American Conference Champions
08, 09, 13 North Division Champions
08 Brabham Cup Champions |
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Donnie Hockey
(Loves To Post!)
USA
1514 Posts |
Posted - 11/09/2013 : 11:28:50 AM
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| Perhaps the two players that would have had to come out of the lineup to make way for Aubin and Pelech are better all-around players and can contribute in more ways than the departed, or better fits with the system that the coaching staff wants to employ. |
www.twitter.com/donhelbig |
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cycfan
(The Next Level!)
243 Posts |
Posted - 11/11/2013 : 7:52:35 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by PsychFan
quote:
Originally posted by cycfan
I'm kind of surprised there is no mention of this trade on Cycloneshockey.com yet. Aubin was our captain, you would think they would at least mention trading the captain away.
http://www.cycloneshockey.com/connect/blog/276/cyclones-deal-mathieu-aubin-and-michael-pelech-to-utah/
Keep those eyes open, champ
Didn't see that story when I went to the website just prior to posting. But hey, thanks for being a douche about it. Btw, clever name, did you think of that all by yourself? |
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Reggie Dunlop
(The Next Level!)
USA
399 Posts |
Posted - 11/12/2013 : 09:28:07 AM
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| Can somebody shed some light on what these alleged "off ice issues" are? I've seen them mentioned multiple times, but haven't seen any specific examples. Just wondering, because Aubin always seemed very generous with his time and chose to return to Cincinnati. Thank you. |
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dbc
(Been Here Awhile)
865 Posts |
Posted - 11/12/2013 : 12:45:00 PM
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| Lets just say it involved legal issues that some might consider minor and some not. I believe the front office was not pleased with their behavior that led to the legal issues, and while they could have stayed, management felt it better for the image of the team and its strong community outreach to sever its ties with the two. It was the front office call and I believe they made the right decision. Lets move on. Nothing with this horse left to beat |
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Billy Mays
(Finally Got A Star!)
71 Posts |
Posted - 11/12/2013 : 2:26:55 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by dbc
Lets just say it involved legal issues that some might consider minor and some not. I believe the front office was not pleased with their behavior that led to the legal issues, and while they could have stayed, management felt it better for the image of the team and its strong community outreach to sever its ties with the two. It was the front office call and I believe they made the right decision. Lets move on. Nothing with this horse left to beat
Thanks for making that clear as mud DBC. Sounds like a bunch of clones on here trying to get the rumor mill all fired up to me.
If you see our roster then you could see the trading of some vets coming soon. We had 6 of our own contracted players, so you go with the younger ones and have to trade a couple to help with the log jam of players since we have so many affiliated players sent down to us. You cant dress 26 a game which we had, so you trade a few of our own to make the roster crunch a little more bearable. Then we get 2 players to be names later in the season when/if we need them due to injuries/call-ups. |
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