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Cyclones4EVER
(Rookie)
20 Posts |
 Posted - 11/23/2007 : 11:54:10 AM
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I also included this photo that was taken of me
in 1991 at Cincinnati Cyclones Home Opener. It made
it on the front page of The Cincinnati Enquirer the next
day. And to answer you question before you ask.
YES, I still have that sign!!!
http://www.flickr.com/photos/cyclones4ever/ |
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HECKLERFROMHELL
(Been Here Awhile)
USA
607 Posts |
Posted - 11/23/2007 : 1:45:54 PM
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WOW!! Those are some memories. I believe I have the answer to all this tho. The media doesn't want to cover it because of the lack of enthusiasm from the fans. Yes, we die hards have enough to go around but we are too few. All the stats show that even after the move the Clones were still successful, and that includes seasons when the Reds and Bengals were in the Playoffs!! So what the HELL happened? The GD Rubber Duckies came in, screwed us all and then left town laughing. I swear, If I see a freakin Green and Purple jersey ANYWHERE, that poor individual will get an earful!!
I applaud the Clones for trying to get this team back on it's feet but they need to do something. Drop the price of tickets if you want to stay. Make it a party once again. Promos galore. They don't have to cost a thing. A little advertising will go a long way, but word of mouth will get out and this franchise can and will thrive again. Until something drastic happens, unfortunately, the Clones will always have one foot in the grave and the other on a banana peel. What we need is the ownership's e-mail addy and number and flood them with all this info. It's up to them. We can only do so much. |
Welcome to Hell Frozen Over |
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CincinnatiFan
(The Next Level!)
USA
288 Posts |
Posted - 11/23/2007 : 2:23:45 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by HECKLERFROMHELL
WOW!! Those are some memories. I believe I have the answer to all this tho. The media doesn't want to cover it because of the lack of enthusiasm from the fans. Yes, we die hards have enough to go around but we are too few. All the stats show that even after the move the Clones were still successful, and that includes seasons when the Reds and Bengals were in the Playoffs!! So what the HELL happened? The GD Rubber Duckies came in, screwed us all and then left town laughing. I swear, If I see a freakin Green and Purple jersey ANYWHERE, that poor individual will get an earful!!
I applaud the Clones for trying to get this team back on it's feet but they need to do something. Drop the price of tickets if you want to stay. Make it a party once again. Promos galore. They don't have to cost a thing. A little advertising will go a long way, but word of mouth will get out and this franchise can and will thrive again. Until something drastic happens, unfortunately, the Clones will always have one foot in the grave and the other on a banana peel. What we need is the ownership's e-mail addy and number and flood them with all this info. It's up to them. We can only do so much.
I am a major Cyclones fan but I need to comment on a couple of these points.
First off - you can't blame a Ducks' fan for the Cyclones' problems. It was a Cincinnati team and especially after the IHL folded it was the better hockey. People want to complain that some of the Ducks' fans are not supporting the Cyclones but Cyclones fans keep throwing attacks at the Ducks fans forever extending a war that made little sense with 2 teams and absolutely no sense with 1 team in town. We need to stop arguing team names and promote hockey as a sport.
Second point is that yes USBA needs to do more but hockey is always going to be a fringe sport around this area. I am sure we have high school football and basketball teams outdrawing the Cyclones and lord knows the other sports overall have more people playing and watching. The media is not wrong to focus coverage on the sports that generate the most interest. It becomes chicken and egg. How do you cover a team nobody is interested in. How do you generate interest if you get no coverage?
This is not going to be done overnight but good beginning steps have been taken. The radio broadcast will catch some people's interest. The education in Hockey concept is brilliant because ultimately the future always depends on capturing the attention of the youth.
Personally I think the Cyclones need to be pushing affordable clothing. Make it cool and affordable for every kid and adult to have a Cyclones' Jacket instead of a Bengals' jacket. How many extra jerseys could you sell at $30 instead of $110? Fans walking around actively (if silently) promoting the sport is the best advertising. Also, every game should be made another unforgettable event. Everyone that walks in the door needs to walk out with a free Cyclones signed photo, key chain or other keepsake. That will build up interest and interest will ultimately result in better media coverage. |
Get Clones instead of Clunkers.
Cincinnati Cyclones
League Champs 2008 and 2010.
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HECKLERFROMHELL
(Been Here Awhile)
USA
607 Posts |
Posted - 11/23/2007 : 2:43:14 PM
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I agree on a few things. But I am not blaming the Duck fans. It was the Duck organization. They knew this wasnot a 2 team market, yet they tried to overtake what we had here. When that didn't work, they left town.
I agree on the cheaper things. Jerseys are tough tho. They are not cheap. But yes, more affordable clothing, even some at stores again would be nice. I know I bought my first jersey at Kohl's because they were out everywhere else. The key chain and/or picture are good ideas, but cost money. Money the Clones don't have to front. More nights like Throwback night are needed. And instead of Denny Hamlin, how about Jimmy Johnson or Gordon or Earndardt Jr?
I believe there are smarter people on here than the ones running the team. How bout we buy them out! LOL I wish!! |
Welcome to Hell Frozen Over |
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bags
(Person With Nothing Better To Do!)
USA
2224 Posts |
Posted - 11/23/2007 : 2:47:56 PM
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Great points are being made and it's a shame that management can't
seem to realize that we(the fans) know just as much as these high
price consulting firms on righting the ship.To "Cincinnatifan", I
don't blame "The Ducks" as much as I blame The Robinson family for
bringing them here. I say that because the cheapskates wouldn't spend
a dime on the Gardens when we and Xavier basketball were lining their
pockets. When we both got fed up and left,The Robinsons "bought" the
Baltimore franchise rights, spent some money to spruce up the Gardens,
and went about to run us out.If they would have spent a 1/4 of the
money involved with the Ducks when we were there in the building, the
proposed expansion would have happened and we would either be drawing
12,000 in the AHL or 15,000 in the NHL by now.I love your clothing idea
and that's why a kiosk in Florence and Tri-County would be great. |
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Hakeedude
(Been Here Awhile)
524 Posts |
Posted - 11/23/2007 : 3:24:06 PM
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I agree that clothing is a great advertising opportunity. And of course, the obvious---cheaper admission leads to more people buying more crap at the concession stands, and hence more money. Also, you need numbers to build enthusiasm. Unless you absolutely love the sport (like most of the people on this board), you will not return to a nearly empty arena cause its just not a fun evening out. Most people get off on the yelling and screaming and hustle and bustle as much as the game itself.
That said, it ought to be a hellof a game tonight!We'll be right above the Dayton tunnel as usual.
Hakeedude |
Pictures of Aloha Music Camp, Moloka`i, and Maui at
http://community.webshots.com/user/hakeedude |
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Donnie Hockey
(Loves To Post!)
USA
1514 Posts |
Posted - 11/23/2007 : 7:25:07 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by bags
I don't blame "The Ducks" as much as I blame The Robinson family for
bringing them here. I say that because the cheapskates wouldn't spend
a dime on the Gardens when we and Xavier basketball were lining their
pockets. When we both got fed up and left,The Robinsons "bought" the
Baltimore franchise rights, spent some money to spruce up the Gardens,
and went about to run us out.If they would have spent a 1/4 of the
money involved with the Ducks when we were there in the building, the
proposed expansion would have happened and we would either be drawing
12,000 in the AHL or 15,000 in the NHL by now.I love your clothing idea
and that's why a kiosk in Florence and Tri-County would be great.
Xavier didn't leave because they were fed up with the Robinsons. They left because it had been their plan to have their own on-campus arena. That was in the works long before the Cyclones came to town.
Any Cyclones fan that wants to blame the Robinsons for the Cyclones failures, or thinks they were forced out of the Gardens doesn't know what they're talking about. Period. The Cyclones were mismanaged. They self-destructed. It wasn't the Robinsons that decided to add more than $850,000 to the Cyclones operating budget by acquiring a soccer team. It wasn't the Robinsons that decided to increase the front office payroll from $150,000 in 1990-91 to more than $1.1 million by 1995-96. Blame the Robinsons if it makes you feel better but they weren't the villians they're made out to be. |
www.twitter.com/donhelbig |
Edited by - Donnie Hockey on 11/23/2007 7:27:05 PM |
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hrc666
(Loves To Post!)
1363 Posts |
Posted - 11/24/2007 : 01:14:00 AM
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If the Cyclone's original owner, Doug Kirchofer, had stayed in the ECHL and at the Gardens, he'd probably be making money today. Instead, he went to the IHL and probably increased his operating budget (salaries/travel) by 200-300%. Possibly more. He couldn't charge much more, so his revenues stayed relatively flat. The second and biggest mistake was buying The Coliseum. He went from a hockey team owner to arena owner/manager. Granted he bought the Coliseum for peanuts ( I believe $15m and put in another 15), but he had no legitimate reason to think that he had any expertise at successfully running an arena. The previous owners (post WHO concert) weren't profitable.
In a nutshell, I think Kirchofer (a nice guy, btw) had what could be called the "four leaf clover" sympton that many small businessmen get. They think that because they were able to be successful at one business that they can translate that success to other business ventures. Kirchofer probably was more lucky than good with the ECHL Cyclones. No one could convince me that he could have expected a 9300 average their 2nd year. The Stingers only averaged about 7000 per game during their 4 years. Sure, he probably marketed well, but hockey had a bit of a faddish appeal during the 90's in many markets which now have no hockey team (Louisiana, Greenville, etc.) He had a gold mine. I'm sure he and his partners cleared roughly a million bucks profit per year in each of the first two years from a $25,000 investment. The move to the IHL was a huge strategic error. Leaving The Gardens (probably over easily solvable issues-I'm guessing) and buying the Coliseum was a near-fatal error in and of itself. Owning soccer and basketball teams was a result of having an arena to occupy. Bloating the Cyclones front office (something like 30 or so employees) was ridiculous. Thinking that minor league hockey(in a major league market) had real corporate appeal a major miscalculation.
And then Robinson backdoored him with The Ducks. Robinson needed a major tenant for his arena and got one. I would have loved to have been a fly on the wall when Kirchofer found out about that move. I wouldn't have and I'm sure he didn't imagine that scenario. The Duck's were more than a curveball thrown at the Cyclones; they were a ninja's 'star of death'. The brutal hockey war began and both sides lost. It was a no-brainer that both wouldn't survive. But the bad feelings created such a schism in this hockey market that it played a large role in killing the Ducks. And The Railraiders. And it may be in large part responsible, at the end of the day, for the demise our our Cyclones. I hope not. Had Kirchofer left well enough alone, I doubt a war would have ever been waged.
I don't judge him for this. For I have been both stupid and greedy many times during my life And will probably continue to be
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"The only way David Desharnais will see an NHL game is if he buys a ticket".
--donnie hockey
"David Desharnais will be invisible during 5 on 5 hockey. IN THE AHL"
--donnie hockey
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Edited by - hrc666 on 11/24/2007 03:31:52 AM |
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hrc666
(Loves To Post!)
1363 Posts |
Posted - 11/24/2007 : 04:21:52 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Hakeedude
So what is the difference between the wildly successful 90s when attendance was amazing both at The Gardens and even after the move to US Bank? Obviously not the level of hockey, since the ECHL days were just as packed as the IHL days. I still remember Cincinnati Magazine calling the Cyclones the "hottest cheap date in town.
Early on, the Cyclones became one of those 'things to do'. It was hot. Faddish. It became fashionable to go and be seen at Cyclones games. I recall running into numerous people I knew who I never imagined to be hockey fans. They were primarily there to enjoy the atmosphere. The hockey was secondary.
Minor league hockey was 'hot' in the late 80's early 90's. Right around the time that Gretzky was sold to LA from Edmonton. For whatever reason there was a great expansion of minor league teams and many were extremely successful. Grab a copy of any ECHL league guide and look at the attendance of teams in the mid to late 90's Compare it to current attendance. See which teams drew 8,000 to as high as 11,000 per game. Many aren't even in existence anymore.
Why? Many of those I percieve as 'faddists' don't come anymore. Fads and fashions change. They only have so much shelf life. Either the game itself or management didn't do a good enough job to convert a large enough percentage of these types from faddists to fans.
The sports market is crowded. People have so many options. It's a tough job to keep the seats filled. Also, most people didn't grow up with hockey either by playing it or watching it from a young age. It's not in their blood, so to speak. This factor is probably very hard to overcome in a saturated sports society.
The NHL has become a bit similar to the Icecapades. Unfortunately the ECHL and AHL have adopted this unphysical game. I look at the ref everytime there is a hard hit to see if he's gonna call a penalty. For the marginal or casual fan, fighting and hard checking was a huge part of the game. The occasional bench clearing brawl was something other sports (including boxing)didn't and don't have. The powers that be in hockey have eliminated this element. I can always tell the roar of the crowd when I'm in the concourse during the game. A fight roar is louder and more sustained than a great goal roar. Hockey has satisfied the media set and their feminized vision of life, but has left the casual fan behind. I seriously doubt that football would be near as popular as it is withoutthe constant, brutal hitting. The well-executed draw play doesn't fill stadiums.
The NHL's foolish loss of ESPN's telecasts (should have done it for free if need be) hasn't helped at all.
But, the fact remains that it was common for 10,000 or more people combined to be at Duck/Cyclone games on a weekend night not very long ago. I believe that Cincinnati has enough dyed in the wool and casual hockey fans to support one team. Hopefully, the Cyclones management can pull this off.
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"The only way David Desharnais will see an NHL game is if he buys a ticket".
--donnie hockey
"David Desharnais will be invisible during 5 on 5 hockey. IN THE AHL"
--donnie hockey
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Edited by - hrc666 on 11/24/2007 04:39:17 AM |
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Caitskee
(Been Here Awhile)
USA
620 Posts |
Posted - 11/24/2007 : 10:19:44 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by HECKLERFROMHELL
So what the HELL happened? The GD Rubber Duckies came in, screwed us all and then left town laughing. I swear, If I see a freakin Green and Purple jersey ANYWHERE, that poor individual will get an earful!!
Are you tempting me? |
~IN CHUCK WE TRUST~ |
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Caitskee
(Been Here Awhile)
USA
620 Posts |
Posted - 11/24/2007 : 10:28:50 AM
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| STFU! Honestly! It's in the past. You can't change a dang thing about it now! The Robinson's brought a higher level of skill into the city which gobbled up some of the fan base. I doubt he woke up one day and said, "You know, those mofos left so I'm gonna spend all this money on screwing them." It probably does make you feel better to have someone to blame but grow up. |
~IN CHUCK WE TRUST~ |
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Donnie Hockey
(Loves To Post!)
USA
1514 Posts |
Posted - 11/24/2007 : 10:31:42 AM
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The Robinsons did not backdoor Doug Kirchhofer and the Cyclones by bringing in another hockey team. The Robinsons informed Mr. Kirchhofer and Rich Neumann they were left with no choice but to pursue another tenant, including a hockey team, after the Cyclones rejected a lease agreement proposal that included everything the Cyclones had asked for and more including a $250,000 annual subsidy to compensate for the $175,000 to $200,000 the Cyclones told the Gardens they estimated they were losing in prospective revenue due to the lack of luxury suites and club seats. The Gardens approached the Cyclones again to talk about a lease early in the 1996-97 season and informed the Cyclones they had another hockey team lined up if they didn't want to get something done. Kirchhofer didn't discount the Robinsons bringing in another hockey team. Neumann did. He thought boarding up the windows and doors would be the only thing the Gardens would be doing after the Cyclones and Silverbacks left.
The Robinsons didn't bring in another hockey team to try and run the Cyclones out of town. They brought another team in because they had a business to run. |
www.twitter.com/donhelbig |
Edited by - Donnie Hockey on 11/24/2007 10:33:15 AM |
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Cyclones4EVER
(Rookie)
20 Posts |
Posted - 11/24/2007 : 11:23:20 AM
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Okay, Back to the topic. Did anybody see any Local News Camera men there last night at the game?
The Answer is there were NO Local News covering the game last night. I kept looking up behind Section 111 where the News Camera men stand getting there footage of the game. There was nobody there all night from the any News Stations in this town. There is NO Excuse why they should not have highlights of the game.
U.S. Bank Arena to WCPO Channel 9 News Station
Distance 1.4 miles (About 6 Min Drive)
U.S. Bank Arena to WXIX Fox19 News Station
Distance 1.8 miles (About 6 Min Drive)
U.S. Bank Arena to WKRC-TV Channel 12 News Station
Distance 2.2 miles (About 9 Min Drive)
U.S. Bank Arena to WLWT-TV Channel 5 News Station
Distance 2.3 miles (About 9 Min Drive)
And if The Cincinnati Enquirer could only write a story as good
as Brain Compton did from the NHL website about how good our team
is doing. http://www.nhl.com/nhl/app/?service=page&page=NewsPage&articleid=344210
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Hakeedude
(Been Here Awhile)
524 Posts |
Posted - 11/24/2007 : 11:46:59 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Donnie Hockey
...The Robinsons didn't bring in another hockey team to try and run the Cyclones out of town. They brought another team in because they had a business to run.
I appreciate this perspective from another point of view. And..... like Caitskee so eloquently (ha) said, it is time to bury all that other crap. We have an excellent hockey team here, today, and there is no other team in town. That other stuff is in the past, so.........seeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeya!
Hakeedude |
Pictures of Aloha Music Camp, Moloka`i, and Maui at
http://community.webshots.com/user/hakeedude |
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Donnie Hockey
(Loves To Post!)
USA
1514 Posts |
Posted - 11/24/2007 : 12:01:36 PM
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| The things the news stations covered last night were of more interest to its viewers. News stations have 2-3 minutes for sports and they're going to cover the stories and show highlights of the things that have the highest level of interest. They're not going to show a Cyclones highlight when there is more interest in the Reds signing Chad Cordero, the Bengals game Sunday against Tennessee, UC, Miami, LSU losing and what that might mean for Ohio State. A news station has a budget and they're going to spend their resources on the stories that matter the most and/or are of the most interest on that given night. There is far more interest in the Greater Cincinnati area in the Reds and Major League Baseball, the Bengals and the NFL, UC, Xavier, Ohio State, Kentucky basketball and football, Miami football and basketball, high school sports, men's and women's golf, men's and women's tennis and Miami hockey than there is in the Cyclones. It's great that the Cyclones are in first place but more people would rather read about a last place MLB or NFL team. It's just the reality of the situation. |
www.twitter.com/donhelbig |
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